SUGGESTION BOX

[Hilary]

BIGJUICE,

Reference to your post #78.Thanks for the interest shown, if I may I would like to share some expereince with you.

Where should I start.
I believe we do not get more that 600 cars (wishful thinking) of paying patrons and assumimg that each car carry three persons we have 1,800 persons. This number times $1,500 is $2,700,000. Remember lots of these cars are driven by none paying people (the club gives out a host of free passes to sponsers, competitors, marshalls an many more)

A point to note is that there are at least 1,000 people who do not pay for entry.Check the hill side. So to assume that we get about 3,000. pepople at the meet is a reasonable guess.

Here is a shocker for you, the cost for a race meet is around six million dollars (this is when I last ran a met) Over 37 expense items on the budget. Prize money and presentation function $1.2 Mil.
Paid advertising $600,000, in addition to this amount we get sponsership from some of the medid houses.There are several other big items.
Ho do not forget that we pay members of the club to assist us in the organising at the track on race day.

Will have to stop here.
Mr.J.

[Duct Tape]

The bridge has had some amount of repair work done on it over the past 2 years.
The welder has repaired parts of the step and the floor nearest to the entrance sign has had to be repaired already.
I will take a look at it myself later on today.

The old LIME tower near the Gullyside has been repaired.
The floor of the ground level has been cast in concrete and the upper level has had its floor replaced. The upper flooring is regularly vandalized, and there is one part that is currently loose just beside the step at the entrance.
The structure has been repaired and repainted.
I don't know who did this repair if it was the JRDC or the concessionaire Debe Chen, but when I inspected it at midday on Sunday, other than the upper level first piece of flooring, it was in good order.
This work was done before the last meet at least. Its not recent.

[toyracer]

I am rather surprise to hear that the new bridge (just a few years old) require repairs.

Salt air is a terrible thing as far as metal is concerned.

It was while watching a Sprint at Dover a few years ago I noticed that the beams that supported the floor of the second floor of the main tower had rotted away from their joints. In effect, the boards of the floor were holding the beams in place. I called David immediately and told him what I observed, and thankfully repairs were made before any accident occurred.

The tower and bridges should be inspected prior to each race meet. Dover isn't as far away from the ocean as many people may think.

[TundaBOLT...4GRacing.....]

the hilltop vip was in need of repairs back at the cmrc meet, didn't go to the independence meet so not sure if it has since been repaired

[Hilary]

Gentlemen,
Further to my post above #102 I omitted to advise that apart from the prize money and trophies expenses, the club issues 10 tickets to each competitor assumiong, 65 competitors with 10 tickets each that means the competitors are getting 36% of the total cost to run the meet. Yet some of them are complaining. Oh apart from this the club is advertising them thus enabling them to procure sponsership.

The JRDC is a club of class. Name another club to compair.

Mr.J.

[Hilary]

Gentlemen, Going over my po I wrote awhile ago I realised that I omotted to include the entrance fees paid by the drivers
$2,500.00 x 65=$162,500.this from$975,000. will give a percemtage of 33% not 36%
Sorry,
Mr.J.

[Hilary]

Gentlemen while I am at it let me tell you a story.

 Some years ago my son Jan invited me to accompany him to a motor cycle race meet in the USA that he was participating in. On my arrival I noticed a hand full of people in the stands I  then enquired where the organiser is getting the necessary funds to pay rental for the facility among other expenses. I was told from the competitors and some sponsors.

Mr.J.

[Duct Tape]

Mr. J, I have to agree with you on the entry fee thing.
The JRDC has possibly the lowest entry fee there is for a sport of this nature and caliber.
The Karting Association has an entry fee of $6,500.00 for the bigger classes and $4,000 for the baby class, and thats an entry level sport.
The MSA/FIA trainer came here last week and said he is organising an event at his track that has an entry fee of $100,000.00 for a one day event. It may even be pounds or Euro, but he definately said 100 THOUSAND.

The practice of the JRDC to issue 10 passes with an entry that costs $2500 should be viewed as prizemoney to each driver, as 8 of the bands are pit passes valued at either $2500 or $3000 and two are general admission passes, valued at $1000.00. So in effect, a driver is getting back $26,000,00 for his $2500 entry paid.

No other motor racing entity in Jamaica pays the level of prize money that the JRDC pays consistently, and the club must be commended for this.
Most others except the popular dexterities as run by some business minded promoters and drag racing (also seeming to be run by some business minded individuals, how coincidental?), don't pay any prize money at all.

[Johnnybaps]

Mr. J, I have to agree with you on the entry fee thing.
The JRDC has possibly the lowest entry fee there is for a sport of this nature and caliber.
The Karting Association has an entry fee of $6,500.00 for the bigger classes and $4,000 for the baby class, and thats an entry level sport.
The MSA/FIA trainer came here last week and said he is organising an event at his track that has an entry fee of $100,000.00 for a one day event. It may even be pounds or Euro, but he definately said 100 THOUSAND.

The practice of the JRDC to issue 10 passes with an entry that costs $2500 should be viewed as prizemoney to each driver, as 8 of the bands are pit passes valued at either $2500 or $3000 and two are general admission passes, valued at $1000.00. So in effect, a driver is getting back $26,000,00 for his $2500 entry paid.

No other motor racing entity in Jamaica pays the level of prize money that the JRDC pays consistently, and the club must be commended for this.
Most others except the popular dexterities as run by some business minded promoters and drag racing (also seeming to be run by some business minded individuals, how coincidental?), don't pay any prize money at all.

dean mind u mek d man dem vex

[EMorris]

The bridge has had some amount of repair work done on it over the past 2 years.
The welder has repaired parts of the step and the floor nearest to the entrance sign has had to be repaired already.
I will take a look at it myself later on today.

The old LIME tower near the Gullyside has been repaired.
The floor of the ground level has been cast in concrete and the upper level has had its floor replaced. The upper flooring is regularly vandalized, and there is one part that is currently loose just beside the step at the entrance.
The structure has been repaired and repainted.
I don't know who did this repair if it was the JRDC or the concessionaire Debe Chen, but when I inspected it at midday on Sunday, other than the upper level first piece of flooring, it was in good order.
This work was done before the last meet at least. Its not recent.

ok DT always on top a tings!

[Hilary]

Will some one with the technical knowledge who have carefully inspected the JRDC's timing equipments and especially those persons who operate these equipment (both the original and stand by unit) what is wrong with these machines. From reports, these equipment old though they may be are working perficitly well.

Awaiting a positive response.

Mr.J.

[CEC]

Mr J,

Maybe the computer being used to receive and process the signals coming from the transponders is too slow .

[toyracer]

How about not pointing the antenna at a wall that itself reflects errant signals, resulting in false hits on the timing system.

[toyracer]

By the way, one of the most common problems I've seen has nothing to do with the timing system itself.

I've lost count of the amount of transponders I've seen mounted on roll cage bars.

I recall that the instructions expressly state that this should never be done.

I once suggested to a racer that his transponder was not mounted correctly and his response was "ah desso mi always put it". I shook my head and walked away.

[toyracer]

By the way, one of the most common problems I've seen has nothing to do with the timing system itself.

I've lost count of the amount of transponders I've seen mounted on roll cage bars.

I recall that the instructions expressly state that this should never be done.

I once suggested to a racer that his transponder was not mounted correctly and his response was "ah desso mi always put it". I shook my head and walked away.

Here is a great example of an incorrectly mounted transponder. Take a look of this in-car video of Kevin Jeffrey.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10202286451625458

1. His transponder is mounted on the front door glass, not behind the B-pillar on the rear door glass.
2. His transponder is mounted backwards; i.e. the writing that is visible on the transponder itself should be facing the glass, facing outside the car.
3. His transponder is mounted 90° out-of-directional phase. Instead of pointing forward, the front of the transponder is pointing up.

Incorrect placement as cited in #1 actually gives him an advantage; even if he was directly beside another car, if that car had its transponder correctly placed on the rear door glass/behind the B-pillar the timing system would score Kevin's car as being in front.

It's unreal that he was allowed to qualify with the transponder in that position and orientation.

[old roach]

It's unreal that he was allowed to qualify with the transponder in that position and orientation

QUOTE FROM TOYRACER.

I saw this and had to comment even thou i dont want to i just had to , cars are not scrutinered with the transponder , its after you pass scrutineering you get it , so the blame here is on the JRDC ,and TIMING & SCORING as transponders are checked in pit lane , by said person that so called checked DOUG GORES transponder , now do you understand where the problem is.

[Armchair racer]

It's unreal that he was allowed to qualify with the transponder in that position and orientation

QUOTE FROM TOYRACER.

I saw this and had to comment even thou i dont want to i just had to , cars are not scrutinered with the transponder , its after you pass scrutineering you get it , so the blame here is on the JRDC ,and TIMING & SCORING as transponders are checked in pit lane , by said person that so called checked DOUG GORES transponder , now do you understand where the problem is.

 Who trained said personnel ?  maybe all they were trained to do is to make sure the transponder is sending out a signal ? I saw them doing it at the last meet. it's the last thing they do as the car is entering the track for qualifying.

[Stoppa]

I am a little confused about the issue of transponder placement. In all my reading it has been emphasized that the transponder should be mounted no more that sixteen inches above the ground , antenna pointing downwards , with a clear line of sight to the ground  , i.e.  no sheet metal , wires , bars ,  etc.  beneath it .
 
This would suggest that the transponder not be mounted inside the cockpit.
 
I think ideal placement would be somewhere in  front of the  radiator support to provide the right height , away from excessive heat and in good airflow , and free from any metal to obscure its line of sight to the ground.
 
Your thoughts ?

[Duct Tape]

I am a little confused about the issue of transponder placement. In all my reading it has been emphasized that the transponder should be mounted no more that sixteen inches above the ground , antenna pointing downwards , with a clear line of sight to the ground  , i.e.  no sheet metal , wires , bars ,  etc.  beneath it .
 
This would suggest that the transponder not be mounted inside the cockpit.
 
I think ideal placement would be somewhere in  front of the  radiator support to provide the right height , away from excessive heat and in good airflow , and free from any metal to obscure its line of sight to the ground.
 
Your thoughts ?

Stoppa, it sounds like you are talking about a mylaps transponder that needs to send a signal to an antenna embedded in the track.
The system currently used at Dover by the KRDC is from Kronos and uses a radio antenna at the side of the track by the pit exit wall, thats why the Kronos transponders need to be at the left side of the vehicle.

@ Toyracer: I noticed that myself when I was watching that video yesterday of Kevin Jeffries.

The link to the video seems to have been taken down.

[Stoppa]

Ok DT , thanks . That clears the issue.....will do some further reading on the Kronos.

[old roach]

It's unreal that he was allowed to qualify with the transponder in that position and orientation

QUOTE FROM TOYRACER.

I saw this and had to comment even thou i dont want to i just had to , cars are not scrutinered with the transponder , its after you pass scrutineering you get it , so the blame here is on the JRDC ,and TIMING & SCORING as transponders are checked in pit lane , by said person that so called checked DOUG GORES transponder , now do you understand where the problem is.

 Who trained said personnel ?  maybe all they were trained to do is to make sure the transponder is sending out a signal ? I saw them doing it at the last meet. it's the last thing they do as the car is entering the track for qualifying.

Once again i dont want to post here but have the feeling that if i dont it will not be looked into. I feel that drivers should have their own transponders that are attached to the car during scrutineering, any thing that is attached to a car should be looked at during the scrutineering process . this would stop the problem that toy racer is talking about.

[Duct Tape]

Posting this here to help spread the word:

JRDC members meeting

JRDC members meeting will be held on Thursday October 10th, 2013.

The meeting will be held at The Liguanea Club starting at 7 pm. Please make every effort to attend.

[Nismodfy]

Promotional Suggestion

Looking @ the issues involved in getting racers to make their cars available for promotional events, going forward the JRDC (as finances dictate) could purchase a "shell" and wrap it in the title sponsors logo as well as marque sponsors.

Depending on the demographics the club decides as their target audience, the selected wrapped "shell" could be

• "Nissan Sunny" - Working Class, Transport, delivery individuals
  

• "Honda Civic" - Young professionals, Middle class teens
  
• "Mitsibuti Evo" - Upper Class race fans
  

or as a nod to the past use of a "legacy shell" such as the Magnum (Currently 4 sale).

This frees up the club to promote @ any time between events & @ high traffic location KFC, Island Grill, Mega Mart, Price Smart, Michi, Portmore Mall and gives the Title sponsors more bang for their marketing $$$$.   

[hours]

It will take some checking around some location owners will not give permission for anyone to "plunk" a race car in their parking lot...especially if the sponsor of the car has nothing to do/there is no business relation with their business... they see it a cluttering their already  limited parking lot with non customers
So it will take some calling around....

[Nismodfy]

It will take some checking around some location owners will not give permission for anyone to "plunk" a race car in their parking lot...especially if the sponsor of the car has nothing to do/there is no business relation with their business... they see it a cluttering their already  limited parking lot with non customers
So it will take some calling around....

Point taken ...... but I was referring to JRDC, a professional organization which would make definite arrangements before "Promo vehicle" is taken to any target site...... The suggestion is a workaround the fact that a lot of race cars/drivers are unavailable to do Circuit racing promotions even a week b4 the event and the perception that sponsors are not getting exposure for marketing $$$ spent with JRDC.

If the "wrapped PROMO vehicle" is a functional vehicle such as Nissan Sunny
(ie ... targeting the "working class", a massive % of population .......

it can do double duty as
1) Pace Car (+ strobe lights),
2) Raceday  entertainment, "Drifting" etc
3) Back drop during Drivers Presentation on Tarmac to help improve race day optics
4) Targeted promotion of a potential "B39/B35/B29 Nissan Sunny series" 
5) JRDC & JAA cross promotion Vehicle re: Road safety program (Race @ Dover not on the street .......... join our B series program).

Additional uses may be found to improve ROI on this expenditure.

[Nismodfy]

With 2014 approaching ....... maybe time 4 JMMC to re-visit the following for a Jamaican National Circuit Racing Championship as proposed by Duct Tape in 2012

Dont know if this is a technical regulations issue, but as I've mentioned to several before, is it possible to have a six event Jamaican national circuit racing championship with events as follows:
February Jamwest
April Easter Dover
May Labor Day Dover
August Independence Jamwest
October Heroes Day Dover
December Jamwest

[Armchair racer]

With 2014 approaching ....... maybe time 4 JMMC to re-visit the following for a Jamaican National Circuit Racing Championship as proposed by Duct Tape in 2012

Dont know if this is a technical regulations issue, but as I've mentioned to several before, is it possible to have a six event Jamaican national circuit racing championship with events as follows:
February Jamwest
April Easter Dover
May Labor Day Dover
August Independence Jamwest
October Heroes Day Dover
December Jamwest

You don't understand finances are tight, besides, if the CMRC survives then you need to consider the time it takes to ship the cars out to those races and back? 4 to 5 race meets incorporating both tracks would be good.

I understand however that there is some difficulty working out arrangement with the owners/management at Jamwest

[Nismodfy]

Appreciate the insight ..... but remember that the JMMC is not the JRDC. The "December - Jamwest" meet seems to be @ issue re: CMRC schedule, so Jamwest could do their Drag thing again.

Agreed ... 5 race meets seems like a good compromise. 

(Not privy to why difficulty working out arrangement with the owners/management at Jamwest but time will tell.)

*added*
"Heroes of Speed" event (October)......... aptly titled would bring the racing series to a close ...... seems like a plan 

[MONTii]

At the last meeting the president said Jamwest owed JRDC cash and until that is paid up there will be no negotiations.. Don't know what has happened since..

[Nismodfy]

With the renewed Business Plan & the annual hunt for Sponsors ( who R going 2 check jrdc.org) more consistent / professional photos would help the Club & Race teams seem more "pro" and not just privateers weekend racing.

All driver profile pics could be updated using the following template as a marketing tool.



On Raceday a designated "backdrop" spot could be chosen and as drivers becomes available b4 or after racing, images captured.

No stress involved. Simple stuff do go a long way, IMO.

[Shifter Kart]

With the renewed Business Plan & the annual hunt for Sponsors ( who R going 2 check jrdc.org) more consistent / professional photos would help the Club & Race teams seem more "pro" and not just privateers weekend racing.

All driver profile pics could be updated using the following template as a marketing tool.



On Raceday a designated "backdrop" spot could be chosen and as drivers becomes available b4 or after racing, images captured.

No stress involved. Simple stuff do go a long way, IMO.

when i did Formula BMW, and at the last race meet i did at Dover in 2010, we had 'hero cards,' a ~6'x6' card with our picture on it, a lot like that one, with our car, name, team and team info, sponsors, and facebook/twitter contact info. Even had an autograph session too.

surprised noone else has done the same.

[Nismodfy]

@SK  ....... Cool stuff   http://www.bmw-motorsport.com/en/formula-bmw/formula-bmw-racing-experience.html 

Something JamWest could explore with ATL or Motor Sales .....

(No track run-off @ Dover ..... so probably unsuitable for training rookies .... can't affort for  to happen while testing) ... Car Dealer would be  

[Hilary]

Rather strange that we have so many circuit race drivers in Jamaica. I wonder where they acquire their driving skills from, is it possible it's from Dover Raceway, that has been in existance for over 25 years.

[Nismodfy]

Mr J .... Not trying to undervalue Dover & its great history but the track is not necessarily Rookie friendly especially when being marketed as a corporate training venue. Being such a technical course, it can be mastered over time as you a racing veteran can very well appreciate.

Question: Even within the land limitations can any portion of the track be reconfigured to improve the "momentum" of the course & thereby reduce the HP battle?

[TundaBOLT...4GRacing.....]

most driving skills came from years on the streets..  just sayin

[Duct Tape]

most driving skills came from years on the streets..  just sayin

Not at all.
It has been my observation and experience that most street drivers who think they are fast and some of the real "road hog" types, do very poorly when it comes to organized competition.
I myself had to unlearn many of the tactics and techniques developed in street driving to be competitive in organized racing.
it seems to be true for sprints, rallies, s\dexteriies and circuit.

[Shifter Kart]

most driving skills came from years on the streets..  just sayin

nope.

[TundaBOLT...4GRacing.....]

Rookies by definition have very little to no experience on tracks...

[sala2]

I have come to love driving at dover and i'm currently upgrading my car and prepping a car for my son to come drive too. we appreciate the levels of the fees and the passes given (same fees at sprint and dex , less passes) but dover costs more to run. don't know if this is the right forum but as a winner at dover and seeing that jrdc is cash strapped could we be given waivers for jrdc membership entry fees and such . my team has no sponsors and is totally self funded (on a meager salary) so this would go a long way . would love a response or direction from anybody on jrdc exec.

[Hilary]

Gentlemen, Some time ago my son Jan invited me to a motor cycle  event he participated in the Florida USA, when I got ther I was surprised to see the stands with a few people, I there and asked Jan where is the cash comming from to stage the meet, his response, form the competitors, mind you there were lost of competitors.

[old roach]

Gentlemen, Some time ago my son Jan invited me to a motor cycle  event he participated in the Florida USA, when I got ther I was surprised to see the stands with a few people, I there and asked Jan where is the cash comming from to stage the meet, his response, form the competitors, mind you there were lost of competitors.

Thanks to the good ole us$

[BIGJUICE]

Gentlemen, Some time ago my son Jan invited me to a motor cycle  event he participated in the Florida USA, when I got ther I was surprised to see the stands with a few people, I there and asked Jan where is the cash comming from to stage the meet, his response, form the competitors, mind you there were lost of competitors.

Difference between a club and a club trying to run like a business...

[Nismodfy]

Consider re-branding JRDC along the lines of Rally Jamaica .........ie DBA .... Circuit Jamaica | Circuit Racing Jamaica or some other more instantly recognisable label. This should greatly assist any proposed transformation going forward.

[Hilary]

Mismodify,
 Ever since my involvement with circuit racing in Jmaiaca(1970) we had the brandings listed below.You are now suggesting another change. I do not think this will make a difference but as the saying goes" nothing venture nothing gain".

Here goes" Jamaica Motor Racing Association, Jamaica Race Drivers Association, Motor Sports Jamaica,Motor Racing Jamaica,MIJAM, ProChamp and JRDC.---JMC/JMMC mainly runs rally

Mr,J.

[BIGJUICE]

Mismodify,
 Ever since my involvement with circuit racing in Jmaiaca(1970) we had the brandings listed below.You are now suggesting another change. I do not think this will make a difference but as the saying goes" nothing venture nothing gain".

Here goes" Jamaica Motor Racing Association, Jamaica Race Drivers Association, Motor Sports Jamaica,Motor Racing Jamaica,MIJAM, ProChamp and JRDC.---JMC/JMMC mainly runs rally

Mr,J.

Mr J,

        Again , the point is none of those organization have/had done an effective job imho, except MIJAM, ( which I was a part of , but only given a 1 event ) ... Please seek professional advise as a club on how to do this EFFECTIVELY!
         Again Ill suggest the club needs to get involved in some charities and and begin to tap into the free publicity and show of good will to the public.
       Utilize the images of your class champions for endorsement of publick issues , such as drinking and driving, or texting and driving... etc... THIS IS ALL A PART OF "BRANDING"
      SEEK PROFESSIONAL HELP!!!

[Hilary]

 Bigjuice, Of all tbhe organisations you are of the view that MIJM with whome you were attached to was the best. Well it was the worst that I have had to deal with.Do know (no you don't) that I was the one who entered inot the agreement with MIJAM on behale of Alfred Chen, yes, I was contracted to by Alfred to rent the facility and I did with MIJAM. Do know that on race day JMC (not JMMC) president Mr.De Souza asked the MIJAM's president to present the insurance certificate so that he can authorise the commencement of the ewvent. He was unable to do so, but because I was the one  who negotated the contract I saw to it  that the eventn was insured and secure a copy of the cefrtificate which I presented to the JMC president. Oh by the way I had difficulty collecting the deposit in order to allow the meetto take place.

 From where I stood, in terms of spectators attendence the meet was a success.However despite my many efforts to get the president to organise the next meet, no response. Later I was given to bleieve that the meet was a financila disaster.  I do not know how true this information was suffice it to say that was the end of MIJAM.

Since you were involved can you tell us what happend to cause the operation to faid away.

[BIGJUICE]

Bigjuice, Of all tbhe organisations you are of the view that MIJM with whome you were attached to was the best. Well it was the worst that I have had to deal with.Do know (no you don't) that I was the one who entered inot the agreement with MIJAM on behale of Alfred Chen, yes, I was contracted to by Alfred to rent the facility and I did with MIJAM. Do know that on race day JMC (not JMMC) president Mr.De Souza asked the MIJAM's president to present the insurance certificate so that he can authorise the commencement of the ewvent. He was unable to do so, but because I was the one  who negotated the contract I saw to it  that the eventn was insured and secure a copy of the cefrtificate which I presented to the JMC president. Oh by the way I had difficulty collecting the deposit in order to allow the meetto take place.

 From where I stood, in terms of spectators attendence the meet was a success.However despite my many efforts to get the president to organise the next meet, no response. Later I was given to bleieve that the meet was a financila disaster.  I do not know how true this information was suffice it to say that was the end of MIJAM.

Since you were involved can you tell us what happend to cause the operation to faid away.

Ha, ha... Wont even go there with u HJ... as you and I know how it REALLY went down, ....

[old roach]

Bigjuice, Of all tbhe organisations you are of the view that MIJM with whome you were attached to was the best. Well it was the worst that I have had to deal with.Do know (no you don't) that I was the one who entered inot the agreement with MIJAM on behale of Alfred Chen, yes, I was contracted to by Alfred to rent the facility and I did with MIJAM. Do know that on race day JMC (not JMMC) president Mr.De Souza asked the MIJAM's president to present the insurance certificate so that he can authorise the commencement of the ewvent. He was unable to do so, but because I was the one  who negotated the contract I saw to it  that the eventn was insured and secure a copy of the cefrtificate which I presented to the JMC president. Oh by the way I had difficulty collecting the deposit in order to allow the meetto take place.

 From where I stood, in terms of spectators attendence the meet was a success.However despite my many efforts to get the president to organise the next meet, no response. Later I was given to bleieve that the meet was a financila disaster.  I do not know how true this information was suffice it to say that was the end of MIJAM.

Since you were involved can you tell us what happend to cause the operation to faid away.

Ha, ha... Wont even go there with u HJ... as you and I know how it REALLY went down, ....

RUDE BOY  tell dem nuh mek nuh lie settle this or wrong info .

[Hilary]

 Rude Boy, Don't do that to us, the suspence is too much, speak up,  Me others want the truth about MAIJAM

Mr.J.

[BIGJUICE]

Rude Boy, Don't do that to us, the suspence is too much, speak up,  Me others want the truth about MAIJAM

Mr.J.

I will not dignify that post or yourself with a reply , as neither deserves my time or energy...